Below is an article I found on the web that reads as a challenge. With much animosity this Baptist preacher attacks the “Church of Christ”. I am sure that Mr. Martin is very sincere but he is sincerely wrong on so many levels. It does not even take a preacher to answer the question put forward because they are all right there in the scriptures. I do not expect that what is written here will change Mr. Martins mind because he demonstrates a rather closed mind. However, it might prevent Mr. Martin from confusing others.
Here
are Questions Mr. Martin posed for
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Mr.
Martin is wrong and here are the |
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1. According to the history of the "Church of Christ," God used
certain men to "restore" the New Testament Church in the
early 1800's. Where was the true New Testament church before
then? Jesus said that the gates of hell would not prevail
against His church (Matthew 16:18). What happened to the church
and where was the truth it was responsible for preaching before
God restored it? |
Since it is restored then it is living proof that the gates of hell have not prevailed. That the Church fell away is not surprising. (Gal. 1:6) We also recognize that there was a restoring of the original Church that took place in the United States as it developed. However, we do not know that there was no one on earth worshiping as God wishes during all the times of the dark ages. What we do know is that Catholics oppressed the Church. Did you know that during Communist Russion only three Denominations were allowed, Orthodox, Catholic and Baptist? But, when the wall fell we found “Seventh day Adventist Baptists”, “Apostolic Baptist”, “Holiness Baptist” and yes, some very close to being “Church of Christ Baptist”. Don’t ever underestimate the power of God or think it is diminished just because you don’t see it. Read 1 Kings 19:13-18 and see that when Elijah thought the people of God had faded out he was so wrong. Ever heard the saying about throwing stones in glass houses? Where was the Baptist church before 1611? |
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2. If a "Church of Christ" elder refuses to baptize me, will I be lost until I can find one who will? Do I need Jesus AND a Campebllite "preacher" in order to be saved? If I do, then Jesus Christ is not the only Mediator (1 Tim. 2:5) and the Holy Spirit is not the only Administrator (1 Cor. 12:13) of salvation - the "Church of Christ" preacher is necessary to salvation for he is performing a saving act on me when he baptizes me! Is this not blasphemy against Jesus Christ and the Holy Ghost? |
First, where does it say that only a “preacher” can baptize? The command is to believe and be baptized and it is the mediator of 1 Tim. 2:5 that is saying to teach and baptize. (Matthew 28:19-20) Why make it more difficult? There is freedom in Christ that leads to an abundant life. Baptism is the completion of your faith in the same way that Abraham completed he faith by trying to sacrifice his son in obedience to the commands of God. God has said through the Bible that Baptism saves. (1 Peter 3:21) Why do you deny it? We are not blaspheming but Paul told us that you would consider our preaching to be foolishness. (1 Cor. 1:21) |
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3. If the water pipes broke and the baptistry was bone dry, would my salvation have to wait until the plumber showed up? If I were to die before then, would I go to hell? If obedience to water baptism is the means of forgiveness of sins, then I would. |
The gospel of Christ is not a book of thou shalts and thou shalt nots like the law of Moses. It is about choosing right or wrong, it is about attitude and faith. All that can be asked of anyone is to obey God. God said to be baptized and it is not optional. The rest must be left to God. |
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4. If my past sins are forgiven when I am baptized in water, and it is possible for me to "lose my salvation" and go to hell after being baptized, then wouldn't my best chance of going to heaven be to drown in the baptistry?!! - before I had a chance to sin so as to be lost again? If I wanted to be absolutely sure of heaven, isn't that my best opportunity? |
The same kind of logic would lead you to consider killing your kids before they are old enough to know the difference between right and wrong to assure their place in heaven. That’s really dumb. There should be no fear in coming up out of the water because Christianity saves and Christianity is an abundant life. 1 Corinthians, a book written to baptized believers commands the withdrawal from one of their number that is living immorally. Delivering that one to Satan makes it pretty clear that if that Christian does not repent he will be Satan’s body and soul. (1 Cor. 5:5) Then in 2nd Corinthians it says to forgive a repenting Christian quickly lest leaving him withdrawn drives such a one to the devil. (2 Cor. 2:10-11) |
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5. If as a Christian I can sin so as to "lose my salvation," just
what sin or sins will place me in such danger? Is it possible to
know at what point one has committed such a sin, and become lost
again? Please be specific and give clear Bible references. |
Matthew 5:15, Is that specific enough? Seeing how close you can get to Sin without going over the line is not the Christian way. The Dark side does not attract us. We do not sin more that grace may abound because that would fly in the face of Lord. (Romans 6:1) So finding the line is not important but seeing how much good we can do is. (2 Cor. 9:8) |
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6. If as a Christian I can fall and "lose my salvation," is it possible to regain it? If so, how? If God "takes away" my salvation, doesn't that make Him an "Indian giver"? How could I ever know for sure that I was saved or lost? |
Most definitely we can reclaim our salvation, but not through baptism again for we can only die to sin once and then the judgment. As I explained in the answer to question 4, 2 Corinthians 2:10-11 it is our repentance that brings us back. And, no, God is not an “Indian giver”. He does not take our salvation away from us, it is us that throw our salvation in his face when we choose sin. Knowing that you are saved is simple, obey God and know that he is faithful and keeps his word. We are baptized into one body. Can we be baptized into the one body again. No, because it makes no since to be baptized into a body we are already in. (1 Cor. 12:13 Eph. 4:4-6) How can read the parable of the prodigal son and not understand the process of falling away and coming home? |
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7. After becoming a Christian, are there any sins that will put me beyond
the "point of no return" so that I cannot regain
salvation? What sin or sins will put me in such jeopardy, so
that, after becoming a Christian, I would be doomed to hell without
any recourse? Please be specific and give me clear Bible references. |
As long as there is life there is hope. The only sin that cannot be forgiven is the one not repented of to death. The Bible reference is Luke 16, it is clear that the rich man wants to repent but it is too late. |
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8. If I committed some sin -whether in thought, word, or deed, one minute
before a fatal car crash - would I go to hell if I did not have
time to repent of it? And, please, don't just say that it's up
to God without giving me a specific Bible reference. |
Here you go again trying to see how close you can get to Hell and miss it instead of keeping your eyes on heaven and living your life to please God. How does knowing how close you can miss hell change the commands of God. The answer does not take specific Bible references, the answer is that it does not. I understand your question, you want to know the technical limits of salvation when failing is not your fault but I will give you the same answer God gave Job when Job thought God was being unfair. He asked Job where he was when God laid the foundation of the world. God wants us to obey him, not question whether he is being fair. If you don’t like that answer you need to consider whether you should fear God. |
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9. Why does the "Church of Christ" insist that their name is scriptural when it cannot be found anywhere in the Bible? The church is referred to as the "church of God" eight (8) times in the Bible, but never is it called the "church of Christ." The verse they use is Romans 16:16, but it doesn't say "church of Christ." Where does the Bible call the church the "church of Christ"? |
I would be satisfied just to be called Christian but so many that are not Christians claim to be Christians that we have had to try to describe ourselves. We are members of the Church that Christ bought. That makes it Christ’s Church or the Church of Christ. So, how can you argue with that? And Romans 16:16 does refer to the congregations of the Church as the Churches of Christ. So, now where in the Bible did the Church get referred to as Baptist? Is it named after John the Baptist? If so, it is not John’s, he did not buy it, own it nor is he Lord of it. (John 3:28-30) How do you justify calling it Baptist? And if you say there is nothing in a name why don’t we call it the Church of Jezebel? Yes there is something in the name and Baptist does not describe it. Church of Christ is not a denomination, it is a description. |
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10. If the "Church of Christ" claims to worship God only as "authorized" by scripture because they sing only (and do not use instrumental music), then where do they get the "authority" to use hymnals, pitchpipes, pews, and indoor baptistries in their worship services? If the answer is that they are "aids to worship," where does the Bible allow for that? Where is your required authorization? If a pitchpipe can be an "aid to worship" for the song service in the "Church of Christ," then why can't a piano be an "aid to worship" for Baptists who may need more help in singing? |
How about rightly dividing the word of God? Paul gives us the example in 1 Cor. 11:17-34 when he considers the Lord’s Supper. What is important is that we not only obey but we consider whether we are accomplishing what God wants. The extreme that you are advocating would require us to meet in third floor rooms and a member of the congregation would have to fall asleep in the window and fall out. That happened but that is not the example. Singing from the heart is the example and hymnals and pitch pipes don’t get in the way of that. Having a choir sing to you or having the song controlled by a piano or organ just does not fill the bill. Let me ask you this, if Jesus himself told you not to use the piano how would you respond? Would you argue, would you tell him it makes no difference or would you just decide you want the instruments and keep going as you are? Well, the way I read it he did say and you are arguing. |
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11. The "Church of Christ" teaches that a sinner is forgiven of
sin when he is baptized in water by a Campbellite elder. Where does
the Bible teach that water baptism is required in order to have
one's sins forgiven? Every time the phrase "for the
remission of sins" occurs it is speaking of the fact
that sins have been forgiven previously!
The Bible plainly teaches that the forgiveness of sins is
conditioned upon repentance of sin and faith in
Christ - never upon water baptism! (Matthew 3:11; Luke 24:47;
Acts 3:19; Acts 5:31; Acts 10:43; Acts 20:21; Romans 1:16; Romans
4:5; et.al.) Where does the Bible teach that forgiveness of sin is
linked with water baptism? When Christ made the statement in Matthew
26:28, "for the remission of sins," it had to be because
they had been forgiven all through the Old Testament! Christ
shed His blood because God forgave repentant and believing sinners
for thousands of years before the Son of God came to "take
away" sins and to redeem us and pay the sin-debt with
His own precious blood. How can one say that "for the remission
of sins" means 'in order to obtain' in light of the fact that
God never uses the phrase in that sense? In the Old Testament God
forgave sin on the basis of a blood sacrifice (Heb. 9:22) - the Old
Testament saints had their sins remitted (i.e., forgiven) but
they were not redeemed until Christ came and shed His blood
at Calvary. Their sins were covered (Romans 4:7; Psalm 32:1),
but the sinner was not cleared of his guilt (Exodus 34:7)
until the Cross (Heb.10:4). Before Calvary, the sins of believers
were pardoned, but they were not paid for (i.e.,
redeemed) until the crucifixion (see Romans 3:25 and Heb. 9:12-15).
When Jesus said, "It is finished," (John 19:30), all sin -
past, present and future - was paid for, and the plan of salvation
was completed, so that 'whosoever believeth in Him shall receive
remission of sins' (Acts 10:43). In Acts 2:38, the people were
baptized because their sins were forgiven (at Calvary
when Jesus said, "Father, forgive them,") and they received
the blessing of forgiveness when they repented of their
sin of rejecting Christ and accepted Him as their Saviour and
Lord. Friend, heaven or hell depends on what you believe about this |
No, the Church of Christ does not teach any such thing but that has already been addressed. Where does the Bible say to be baptized for the forgiveness of sins? Mark 16:16 says believe and be baptized to be saved. No matter how you read that it says believe and be baptized. How can you ignore the word “and” in that sentence? If that is not enough then James 2 tells you it take more than faith and 1 Peter 3 explains how the process of Baptism works and the consideration of the water. Further, every conversion after Christ’s death on the cross, included Baptism. If the Bible teaches so plainly that the forgiveness of sins is conditioned upon repentance and faith explain James 2:22 which clearly says that you have to do something or your faith is not complete. What do you think it is that completes our faith? We never said that Baptism earns you salvation because mankind cannot earn salvation or we would boast of it. So what does James 2:26 mean when it says faith without works is dead? It means that Noah would not have been saved from the flood if he had not entered the ark. He believed but failing to act on that belief would have caused Noah to be lost. Did Noah earn his salvation? No, God gave it to him but that does not change anything about the completion of his faith. (1 Peter 3:18-22) You say that Acts 2:38 told them to be baptized because they had already been forgiven. That just not fit. In verse 37 it says they were stabbed in the heart. If they had just found out their sins were forgiven wouldn’t they be rejoicing and not cut to the heart with guilt? They were asking what they needed to do to get forgiveness and Peter told them to repent and be baptized. Why? They were to repent and be baptized for the remission of sins. Why would he have told them to do something for the remission of sins if they were already forgiven? You have to be able to see that you are just denying what the Bible says in order to maintain your beliefs that have no basis in the Bible. Yes, your destination in eternity does depend on what you believe and if you believe that Baptism plays no part in salvation you do not believe the Bible.
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12. If salvation is not by works of righteousness which we have done, and baptism is a work of "righteousness," then how can water baptism be a part of salvation? (Titus 3:5; Matt. 3:16) In the Bible, we are SAVED BY GRACE, and grace does not involve human effort or merit - grace is grace and work is work! (Just read Ephesians 2:8,9 and Romans 11:6.) |
Baptism is an act of faith and not a work of doing right so I can earn a place in heaven. In Titus 3:5 what is the “washing of regeneration” if not baptism. I agree that we are saved by grace but baptism is not a work of merit. Do you notice in Titus 3:5 that Grace does not save us all by itself but it is “through faith”. Eph. 2:9 says not by works and James 2:24 says “justified by works” so there are different kinds of works and the ones that are trying to earn salvation don’t get us saved and the ones that are acts of faith do. Baptism is an act of faith. |
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13. The "Church of Christ" teaches that "obeying the Gospel" includes being baptized in water in order to be saved. If this is true, then how is it that the converts of Acts 10 were saved by faith before and without water baptism? The Bible says in Acts 5:32 that only those who obey God may receive the Holy Ghost - so what did those in Acts 10 do to obey and receive the Holy Ghost and be saved? In the light of Acts 10:34-48, Acts 11:14-18, and Acts 15:7-11, how can anyone honestly believe that water baptism is necessary to salvation? Simon Peter said their hearts were "purified by faith" (Acts 15:9) and that we are saved by the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ like they were (Acts 15:11); that is, before and without water baptism! We know that unsaved people do not receive or have the Holy Spirit (John 14:17; Romans 8:9). We know that the Holy Spirit is given only to those who have believed on Christ (John 7:39). We know that the Holy Spirit seals the believing sinner the moment he puts his faith and trust in Christ as Savior, before he is ever baptized in water (Ephesians 1:12,13). How does the warped theolgy of Campbellism explain away these clear passages of Scripture without "muddying the waters" of truth and drowning its members in eternal damnation? |
How can you be so educated and miss the gospel so severely. In Acts 10 you are assuming that they are saved because they are filled with the Holy Spirit. It does not say so in Acts 10. And how can you dismiss the rest of the chapter? If they are saved why is Peter’s first thought to get them baptized? And as to Acts 5:32 they are obeying God but they have not been baptized so if they stopped short of baptism they would not be saved. Satan obeyed God when he commanded him not to touch the body of Job but that did not save Satan. In light of all that has been said here how can you deny that baptism is necessary to salvation? You are ignoring all the scriptures that say it is. John 14:17 and Romans 8:9 do not say that unsaved people do not receive the Holy Spirit, they say that the disobedient will not receive it and the it will not dwell in those that are not of the body. We enter the body through baptism. Ephesians 1:12,13 does not say that. It says that “the gospel of our salvation, in whom also believing,” . The gospel of salvation is to hear, believe, repent, confess and be baptized and those that believe it will complete their faith through baptism. Notice I never mentioned Alexander Campbell because it has nothing to do with him; this is scripture, pure and simple. Calling us names does not change that. And fear the day of judgment when you have to explain about all the people you prevented from obeying the gospel by telling them that they were saved when they are not. |